Posts by Mr Rocky

21

Help - shunning stories needed

by Mr Rocky in

my letter to the editor to the davenport times just came out on june 30, 2005. the spokane spokesman review is interested in doing a story about shunning as a result of reading my letter.

the religion reporter wants to start working on it wednesday.

does anybody want to tell their story of odd things they have been shunned for by jw's.

Mr Rocky

My letter to the editor to the Davenport Times just came out on June 30, 2005. The Spokane Spokesman Review is interested in doing a story about shunning as a result of reading my letter. The Religion reporter wants to start working on it Wednesday. Does anybody want to tell their story of odd things they have been shunned for by JW's. Maybe you have a personal strange story about how the elders acted to disfellowship someone? Has anybody been shunned or disfellowshipped for bringing a pedophile problem up lately at the kingdom hall. If anybody is willing to be part of this possible story please post here or e-mail me, rocky_fitzp@hotmailcom , title it "letter" or I might delete it. My letter follows (I tried to attach the JPEG image of the actual article, but am not computer savvy enough to have been successful):
'Shunning' Impacts Family Relationships At the time of Davenport’s High School Graduation, 2005, I learned that I had been "marked" and was to be "shunned" when my brother, Jory, informed me that my wife and I were not welcome at my nephew Jade’s graduation reception. The reason he gave was because my sister-in-law, Andrea, believed if we came to the reception, then invited guests who were Jehovah’s Witnesses would not attend. This is because errant Jehovah’s Witnesses are to be shunned by others in the faith. This means no social contact with Jehovah’s Witnesses, including Jehovah’s Witnesses family members . Shunning is done to awaken the wrongdoer to repent and bring him/her back into the fold for such sins as adultery, fornication, drunkardness, thievery or worse. Three days later I was officially expelled (i.e., excommunicated, disfellowshipped), and officially shunned by the Davenport Congregation of Jehovah’s Witnesses. As bad as shunning is in this world, being expelled from the church also infers NO AFTERLIFE, PERIOD.

However, there is a religious crime even more offensive in the eyes of Jehovah’s Witnesses than what I have heretofore mentioned—and that is to doubt that this religion, which is directed by its corporate head, the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, Inc., is the only way to salvation, and the only religion directed by God. Any questioning by a baptized member regarding the religion’s teachings, many of which have been modified and changed, leads to expulsion from the congregation. This questioning is termed "apostasy," and, apparently, I have been judged guilty of "apostasy" due to my voiced concern about my church’s policies regarding the handling of sexual child abuse accusations and the reporting of such accusations.

Victims by the thousands have come forward due to the efforts of sympathetic individuals who support the Silentlambs organization, which has spearheaded the disclosures about the sexual child assault problem within Jehovah’s Witnesses’ congregations. See www.silentlambs.org for complete and accurate information. At this web site you can view twenty TV documentaries from around the world and also hear the local Mark Fuhrman show discuss this matter. These programs have thoroughly analyzed the accusation made by victims and victim’s advocates that Jehovah’s Witnesses’ organization has become a "pedophile paradise."

It has deeply saddened me that my religion protects pedophiles because of their continuing inadequate and antiquated rules that were followed by many churches during the Dark Ages. One such rule requires reporting an accusation to the church elders first before the police, thus, allowing DNA to be lost. Other rules silence victims, and may allow pedophiles to sit unknown next to Jehovah’s Witnesses and their children in church and at social functions.

I believe that Jehovah’s Witnesses should stop interfering in what is police business. If the Witnesses want to forgive pedophiles, okay, but let these criminals serve time in prison too! That’s part of repentance. The elders should not cover up criminal behavior just to make the religion look good.

It is quite possible that no local area Jehovah’s Witness will ever read this letter because they have probably been told not to read the newspaper. This is because I warned the elders I would write to the paper if I could not address the congregation as a whole (Matt 18:15-17). The elders refused my request. The congregation will obey without question!

The only thing that will have any effect on Jehovah’s Witnesses in this matter is if you challenge them when they call at your door. If we can be of any assistance to further help you to understand this subject, give us a call. Joel and Linda Jahn 509-725-2122

32

how to live with JW

by freefly in

hey,.

my partner in life (26yrs) has been converted to jw by his mother.. i am not one to whine -as very aware many have more troubles in their life.. i suppose one of my fears has been this exactly- as i know he was raised jw and should have saw the "signs.

" he always regularly visited with his mom, which i respected as felt a good sign he had a mother/son relationship.

Mr Rocky

I just saw that your kids are older. Don't let that stop you from educating them because he will start in on them next!

32

how to live with JW

by freefly in

hey,.

my partner in life (26yrs) has been converted to jw by his mother.. i am not one to whine -as very aware many have more troubles in their life.. i suppose one of my fears has been this exactly- as i know he was raised jw and should have saw the "signs.

" he always regularly visited with his mom, which i respected as felt a good sign he had a mother/son relationship.

Mr Rocky

Hi Freefly, I would tend to believe that your significant other is using your need for love to entice you to a new JW relationship with him. In other words he withholds what you need tell he gets what he wants. Old tactic in many relationships. He would like to convert you before he marries you. This would be the ultimate win for him. As marring an unbeliever will be frowned upon and slows fast qualification to many JW privileges. These privleges will then take time from your family life.

What to do?

I believe that if you don't want to convert (obviouly not) you will have a miserable life with this Jerk. He will use this "theocratic warfare" on you from now on!

Wouldn't it be interesting to start going out everytime he goes out to the meeting, See if he cracks first. Or ask to have him stay with the kids for your night out because you had to watch them on meeting nights? If your kids are young. One would have to be careful here though for the kids sake. Don't uses them as a pawn. Proably the best would be to take the kids to the movies without him. Go to all movies that expose cults. Educate them on mind control. Show them silentlambs.org and the news shows there.

Educating yourself on JW stuff is probably a waste of time and a daunting task.It took me 4 years to study my way out of them biblically. I had to litterly prove they weren't connected to god. I had to condition my mind continuiosly to think out of their box.. That maybe because I grew up in the teachings. My wife on the other hand left because of their lack of love, deciding it on her emotions and within minutes.

By the way your sex life will also change. Don,t expect to ever be satisfied again!

99

How many years left to Armageddon

by JH in

with all the emphasis put on armageddon in the org.

can we throw away all the signs that jesus gave, just because we quit being a jw?.

does armageddon scare you as much as when you were a jw?

Mr Rocky

Alan F, couldn't have said it better. JH go ahead and set us a date for the end everybody else has but don't expect me to preach it. I'll wait to see if your right first before I waste my life on your guess.

15

My dilemma

by eyeslice in

jw
friends

i have been associated with the jws all my life, recently turning 50 years old.

i was a true believer, a hard working elder, very zealous for the truth, a pillar in the congregation, and a fine speaker and teacher.

i even served in an extremely difficult foreign land for a while with my family.. i always knew we had our problems, but felt that it was my responsibility to effect change from within.

Mr Rocky

Dear EYE,

I agree with the slow fade posts above. If you have low hours or none in the field service they will not re-appoint you to elder. If they try, remind them that you don't feel you are taking the lead and that you need time. No matter how often and by how many you are afronted with being saved stick to your story. Among my ex-Jw friends the worst thing is not to be able to communicate with relatives ie. sons daughters and especially grandkids. Poor consolation to be free of one religon only to find out that they are all the same and on top of that to lose your family. Some friends have studied themselves into atheism, you never know were you will wind up once your mind is free. Imagine changing your religion on principals that you believe are for god, then lose your family, then believe god is not! Child abuse and other concerns can be fought from within just as well and may better than from without!

Rocky

23

Should jw women B obese?

by badboy in

jw
friends

.

i understand that in prehistoric europe that they had `venus' figurines that reperested the `mother goddess'.. these show an obese `woman' and r rather obscene and indecent so please do not show links 2 pictures of any of these figurines.

Mr Rocky

The word Gluttony as mentioned above does not seem to be defined by overweight according to the dictionary. Another words seeing a fat person is not the same as seeing a gluttonous one. From the definitions in my Oxford Dict. I would say that the old stories of a King sitting down to a great banquet table and eating untill he upchucks from natural causes and doing this again and again untill the night is gone or untill he passes out drunk which ever comes first.

Rocky

21

Being called brother/sister in public places

by JH in

jw
friends

how did you like being called brother or sister, when you were in public.

i remember once i was inside a bank waiting in line, and all of a sudden , a brother also waiting in line, said to me quite loud, hello brother x .

i felt like a jerk, being called brother in front of everyone there.

Mr Rocky

I once made the mistake of introducing the CO as Brother so&so at the door of a return visit of mine.

BOY was that a mistake!!! Read me the riot act and told me to say MR. so&so

Yours Mr. Rocky, P.S. and I DO MEAN MR. ROCKY to all of youses out there!

18

Looking for a scripture for CO/Elders visit...

by meat pie in

.

can anyone help me please, i think i remember a scripture something like; 'if a man tells you to do something and doesn't do it himself, don't listen to him'.

i cannot find it, i thought it was in proverbs(nwt) but maybe i imagined it.. anyway, it is possible that the co might visit me late december, i have made a few informal requests, and i'd like to be massively prepared.i have a whole array of un documents/info ready.. if you can help with the above scripture i'd be thrilled.. ta, meaty.

Mr Rocky

Hi to Meat Pie,

When I had my last encounter with a sheparding visit I found that keeping them on the defensive was the best. However the subject you use is very important and your self control is a must for staying on tract. If you are asked about your loyalty to the org ( I brought it up myself by asking "what is the truth, and how can the truth keep changing considering god and his word the bible does not lie. Does not this prove somebody is just guessing at what it is saying. Truth is only in past events or true understanding of present events but noboby can claim they have absolute truth of a future event unless they have direct communication with God or can interpret the bible with holy spirit which is still direct commune with God. I then incorporated 1975 predictions by reading directly out of my old copy of "Life Everlasting in Freedom of the Sons of God" book p.26-35 which at the end of the chart1975 is end of 6-thosand years of man's existance. Of couse you have to also remind them at that time they pushed their 7th creative day chronology to the hilt also in the afore mentioned book)." At this point I also pointed out the change in the "this generation" of 70 or 80 years understanding to a generation of wicked people that has no end time frame. " All this, I said, shows how dim the connecting to god we really have, doesnt it. Given this info then what kind of loyalty should be shown." They insisted that I come back to the kingdom hall anyway, I told them that I will be keeping an eye on the Teachings and when I see they have the whole truth then I might go again. They insisted again, I futher said you don't want me there because I would talk to much! They want to know about what, I said about anything I want to! They finally gave up and left wishing me well, I let them pray and everthing. We parted friends. To this day we still speak to each other and am in business in a small way with another elder. I also can talk to JW family altough some are reserved waiting for me to utter apostate stuff, but they may ask some day.

Noticed that I used their books and no apostate info. I came to the heart of the matter in away that cannot be refuted."The truth" one of thier own secret words was demolished. Maybe I am in a special situation were this worked for me, it may not work for you. Some want to go out in a big flame of glory,I figure that being somewhat in I can still cause havoc. Nothing worse and fear inspiring than an apostate within, wahahah.

41

Ray Franz -some personal recollections.

by Gilgamesh in

this is my first post.

please forgive its length, its bad timing, its preachiness, its prejudices, etc.

it's just one more opinion that i feel obligated to add.

Mr Rocky

We seeem to be concerned about Law of the Watchtower but not Law of the land here. WE are told to be in subjection to the superior authorities. I know of no scriture that says you cannot go to court, only that you lose all your money if you do. Back then the Apostles had Holy Spirit for deciding judgments and they could kill you on the spot, do we have that now, if so prove it. Even if one uses the two witness rule in the congregation it is no reason to intimidate them into not going to the superior authorities. Paul even used Roman citizenship to get a hearing against the Jews.

Bill Bowen can use all the help possible in the Law cases before the courts. I am thinking at first that Bill would have liked to have any info that Ray Franz may have had on the cases, as regards the thinking of the governing body, at the time when he was at the top. However it is obvious that Ray has no information on the subject and should be left alone!

20

Dying you will not die?

by Kagloo in

i have a question that has puzzled me since i got my large print bible...... in genesis 2:17 it states.... but as for the tree of the knowledge of good and bad you must not eat from it, for in the day you eat from it you will positively die.".

the footnote reads.... lit.. " dying you will die.

" okay i understand that... .

Mr Rocky

Your Gen 2:17 and 3:4 question is very interesting. Considering I favor the Preterist view of Bible interpretation, these scriptures, if referring to the after-life, fit in well. I notice that the Serpents phraseology "not to-die you-will-die" (Gen 3:4) is not simply a repeat of Eves statement in Gen 3:3 "you-will-die" with "not" added. It is however a negative statement to Gods "to-die you-will-die" in 2:17. The "not" may refer to the entire phrase of "to-die you-will-die" or just to the "to-die-----" part, I dont know, or what difference it would make. It does seem to be an issue of losing the after-life and that physical life was going to end in returning to the dust no matter what. If so when you partook of the tree of life it was a metaphor for being in the presence or communion with God (or having life), therefore when you died physically you went to the presence of God. We lost that ability and instead went to Hades. When Christ came to earth, gave his life and started "the kingdom of the God inside of you is" (Luke 17:21) the ability to go to heaven (presence of God) or eat from the tree of life was restored (Rev:22:2). Death and Hades was thrown into the lake of fire. (Rev 20:14.) With this view the Bible is a book of redemption what Adam lost we are to gain back. If he lost the after-life then the after-life is what we gain back.

Mr Rocky